Bad sale

[evans_usmc69]

Very nice of you Butch!

[fishaholic211]

24/7 that is so legit brother!

[RJOE]

Water temperature affects buoyancy. There's a big chance that a super slow sink bait that was tested in the summer would float in the winter. Also, like someone mentioned earlier, the sink rate would be different if the bait was tested on a flouro line. Did you change anything on the the bait e.g. the hooks and split rings? Does the bait float while deadsticking or on a retrieve? Slide swimmers rise up on a retrieve.

 

I hope you resolve your issue. I've never had any issues with any of my transactions in the black market. I'm lucky I guess.

Water temp does have a big effect on buoyancy but in the opposite direction. It should sink faster in cold water.

Warm water sits on top of cold water like in summer you can dive down 10' and notice a significant decrease in water temperature from what you would see on the surface because the colder water has slower moving molecules from what I've gathered, in Winter time when water is mixed and somewhat evenly cold you would notice a bait sinks quite a bit slower in the Winter time even though there is more oxygen retention in the water the molecules are slowed making the water more dense. Warmer surface water typically has less oxygen. I first fished a BAA Heavy Floater in the dead of winter in water temps in the 30's I cranked the bait down and it damn near suspended in place after waiting for a few minutes the bait finally came back to the surface, this was using mono and the bait was maybe 2' down. Fishing the same bait in the Summer time I noticed the bait would surface after shorter periods 20-30 seconds.

 

I fish ripbaits a lot in the Winter time here and a perfectly suspending bait in the Winter time almost always becomes a slow sink in the Summer. Many baits have specific tune's so they suspend best in a specific water temperature.

 

I could be wrong, but I'd like to hear your reasoning as to why a bait would sink faster in the Winter time/in colder water?

This is a great topic, the reason I stated that baits will sink faster in cold water is that as a baitmaker I am forever having to take conditions in the different parts of the country into account. Living in New England I am forced to test baits in near frozen water for several months out of the year. One of the things I often have to do is balance deadstick floating soft baits, the object is to get them to sit low in the water but not sink. I often balance them in a bucket at about 70 degrees, however if I then take them out to the pond to test them further they sink. After reading your response on this I went and grabbed a carp bait that I am shipping out tomorrow and balanced it at room temp. I then added hot water and was able to raise the bait about 1/2 inch out of the water. Then I ran cold water until the bait sat so that just the tip of the dorsal fin was at the surface. Added some ice to the water and the bait went to the bottom. I am not exactly sure from a scientific standpoint why this happens but the reality is the soft baits I make sink quicker in cold water and I am sure others do as well.

[slideaction]

awesome gesture thanks

[colbypearson]

This is a great topic, the reason I stated that baits will sink faster in cold water is that as a baitmaker I am forever having to take conditions in the different parts of the country into account. Living in New England I am forced to test baits in near frozen water for several months out of the year. One of the things I often have to do is balance deadstick floating soft baits, the object is to get them to sit low in the water but not sink. I often balance them in a bucket at about 70 degrees, however if I then take them out to the pond to test them further they sink. After reading your response on this I went and grabbed a carp bait that I am shipping out tomorrow and balanced it at room temp. I then added hot water and was able to raise the bait about 1/2 inch out of the water. Then I ran cold water until the bait sat so that just the tip of the dorsal fin was at the surface. Added some ice to the water and the bait went to the bottom. I am not exactly sure from a scientific standpoint why this happens but the reality is the soft baits I make sink quicker in cold water and I am sure others do as well.

After your post earlier I started looking into the topic and asked a few friends for insight (thanks Ali), I guess that water is at its densest point around 39 degrees and as it cools it expands and becomes less dense ultimately to the point it freezes and floats. So I guess that baits will be the most buoyant in the low 40's down to about 39 degrees once the temp drops below 39 water becomes less dense and if it was down in the mid to low 30's a bait might actually sink faster than if it was in slightly warmer water, definitely interesting! I did not know this yesterday, thanks for inspiring some learning Joe! .

[Bonesaw]

A baits density will also change when it is colder. So depending on the change in bait density(depends on bait materials) and water density you could quite a change in sink rate.

 

Dave

[High Power Swimbaits]

The difference may be at near freezing the water is almost ice which floats and is less dense than just cool or cold water above freezing. Just cool or cold water but not near freezing from say 38 to 60 like most except the north part of the US of the country sees on a normal basis is more dense than the hot or warm water and causes baits to float higher. In the south during a hot summer most of the time the most oxygenated water is at the surface even though it is slightly warmer then the water below. All my baits that suspended or were super slow sink this summer this summer need weight added to make them suspend now. That's soft baits as well as hard baits. Could also be as said a difference with materials.

[Hookedonbass]

Thanks everyone for the input I appreciate it. And special thanks to mr brown. Good peeps all around. Thanx SU

[Jerrystowing]

Butch is a class act period!proud to live in the same neighborhood.

[CPBassFishing]

This site has gotten way better since butch got here.

[Bigwilliestyle]

Great info on water temps affecting baits and awesome gesture by Butch.

[urbanhick]

Butch is a class act period!proud to live in the same neighborhood.

Yes he is inquired on FB about getting an eye for my 250 and he sent me a bunch.

[RJOE]

I will add a little more to the floating/sinking part of this post.. The transition of the bait sitting high in the warm water to sinking in icewater was smooth throughout the temp change. At no point did the bait start to sit higher as the water cooled and then reverse at very cold. The bigger factor is not the density of the water being hot or cold but the effect of the hot or cold on the bait. I t can get tough when someone in CA is looking for a specific ROF and I am looking for rivers that are moving to fast to freeze over. A lot of science and math goes into the making of baits but in the end you don't know for sure what a new bait will do until you get it in the water. More often than not it's back to the drawing board but sometimes a pleasent surprise.

[smalliebigs]

I think Joe hit on the key point. It is RELATIVE density. Yes, the waters maximum density is around 39. But the bait is also getting more dense as temp decreases, and its density is increasing at a faster rate than the water. Exact rate depends on structure/materials of the bait.

[evilcatfish]

Its awesome that Butch is taking care of the OP! And I gotta say I found all the water/bait density talk was very interesting.

 

The above being said, it still sounds like the bait being sold was misrepresented